Community

I have created this blog as a forum for continuing the informal discussion began elsewhere:

Dave said...
I like the utopia idea and think I've probably talked with John about it before. I would prefer a milder form, however, where some possessions are still held privately--in particular each family would have its own house--total communal living would lend itself to the kind of hierarchy that might detract from the individual families. I am not, for example, interested in living under a patriarch who makes all the decisions for every family, nor would I want to be one. In my utopia, the land would be held communally, as would a number of shared buildings such as a schoolhouse, chapel, dining hall, and recreation/fellowship hall. In my vision there is also a lake, but that's not necessary. Everyone would have to work together, but each family would retain some autonomy. I doubt that adultery would be a huge problem in a community that was built around shared values and faith--although in the more extreme communism (with several families sharing the same house, where a male leader might emerge to make decisions for everyone), there is a greater chance. This sort of a community begins to resemble a cult. Thanks for the kind words about the Long Walk. Indeed, one day we will be victorious!
1:02 PM

Dusty M Brahlek said...
I agree with the cult comment, it would be hard to keep that from happening. After I posted these John reminded me that we could have a community of homes, we do not have to be in one home :) I would also think purchasing or having a set of condos built would be OK as well.
3:23 PM

John R.P. Russell said...
I look to the early Christian communities as a model of what I am talking about. And to the monasteries, which I believe have best preserved the original idea of a Christian community. A Christian community is necessarily a patriarchy - that patriarch being called "bishop" (monasteries are headed by an abbot, which is simply a monastic bishop). I do agree, David, as Dusty points out in her last comment, that separate dwellings are a good idea.
7:54 PM

Dave said...
A Christian community is a patriarchy but not in the sense I'm talking about. The monastic example is accurate, however. All the monks vow obedience to the abbott, just as I could see a situation where one family (or its head) becomes the ruler of the other families in an absolute sense. This is the situation I would want to avoid, since I do not think it would be appropriate for a community of families to vow obedience to one of the other families (or its head, although the distinction would not always be clear). The system is much better suited for unmarried men and women who choose it.
8:56 PM

John R.P. Russell said...
I agree that the situation you describe is not desirable.I believe the ideal Christian community would obey it's rightful patriarch - that being their celibate bishop, not one of the other families or its head. This community should have celibate and married members, just like the early Christian communities. To one such early Christian community, the Smyrnaeans, St. Ignatius of Antioch wrote: "See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God.... Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church."http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0109.htm
10:01 PM

Dusty M Brahlek said...
Where do we get this "bishop"? Then the next question would be would he be Eastern or Western? I HAVE IT!!!! We can take Fr. Mitch Pacwa! I think he would be good for both... :) We have LOTS of work before we start our community. But then again we have what, 4-5 years, right?
9:28 AM

Dave said...
Sounds reasonable. If you can get the bishop, I'll scout out some land.
1:26 PM

John R.P. Russell said...
My love for the Eastern Church is in part due to the fact that I find the way of life it promotes to be more in accord with that of the Early Christians. Eastern Christianity simply has greater reverence for the Early Fathers of the Church and their Tradition. This closeness with the Early Christian communities I seek to emulate is, I think, a good argument that our community should be Eastern. (What did you think I'd say? )
9:18 PM

John R.P. Russell said...
Getting the bishop first is actually not, I think, the way to go about it. The formation of such a community begins with the gathering of like-minded faithful. St. Francis, for example, was a deacon. He was never ordained a priest, let alone a bishop. Yet it was he that gathered the community. The abbots came later from within the community.
9:22 PM

dave said...
In that case, I'll expect some help scouting out the land.
9:35 PM

Dusty M Brahlek said...
Good land... that will be in PA... right?
8:56 AM

Dave said...
It will depend: do we want good land or, like the Mormons, lots of cheap land that no one else wants?